We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby barjac » Jun 3rd, '11, 16:33

Fyr wrote:Escuse mua, but I'm gonna post my sadness..
It would be more constructive to file bug reports.
https://bugs.mageia.org/
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby ahmad » Jun 3rd, '11, 18:43

Fyr wrote:Escuse mua, but I'm gonna post my sadness..

I'm really displeased that Russian language is missed by the developers in: 32-, 64-bit DVD and Dual-Arch distros at the download page. But there'are presented its dialects - Belorussian and Ukranian. Why? You have cut your Russian-speaking users from 400 mlns to 60 mlns.

How so? I see these packages on the both the i586 and x86_64 DVD ISO's:
locales-ru
hunspell-ru
autocorr-ru
mythes-ru
hyphen-ru
libreoffice-langpack-ru
mozilla-thunderbird-enigmail-ru
mozilla-thunderbird-ru
myspell-ru_RU
man-pages-ru
calligra-l10n-ru
kde-l10n-ru
firefox-ru

c.f.
ftp://ftp.mandrivauser.de/mirrors/Magei ... x86_64.idx
ftp://ftp.mandrivauser.de/mirrors/Magei ... 1-i586.idx

So, obviously I don't see how Russian localisation is missed at all.... no one is cutting Russian-speaking users out in anyway, AFAICS.

Also the russian version of the site is translated partly, awry, there is no Mageia's russian forum.

The web sites are translated by contributors, if there aren't enough Russian translators, unfortuantely there's nothing Mageia can do about that.

If you have the most Mandriva's developers, why do Mandriva's russian pages update in time, there are the support, software mirrors and update?

Again that depends on how many developers/translators know Russian in the distro.

P.S. I have decided not to install Mageia, because Mandriva is approved by Russian users, EduMandriva is widely used all over the CIS (~1/3 of the planet)

Your call; as always, use the distro that fits your needs best.

and Mageia is a fork of the fork of the fork and has the shady future.

Now that was totally uncalled for... if you don't like it, don't use it and use the one you like best, that's what Linux has always been about. :)
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby bbi-nexus-bbi » Jun 4th, '11, 03:54

Congratulations for coming together to produce Mageia and my thanks for delivering on time as promised.. :D
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby bbi-nexus-bbi » Jun 4th, '11, 04:02

Fyr wrote:and Mageia is a fork of the fork of the fork and has the shady future..
Please explain why you make this assumption. I say the future is very bright and fruitful for Mageia. The only shady future I can see is me continuing to run Mandriva as my main system.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby macxi » Jun 4th, '11, 17:19

Anne Nicolas,

Congratulations for the important work of the whole team Mageia.
And thanks to everyone who contributed to this important event for free software.

hugs

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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby krnekit » Jun 4th, '11, 18:44

To all people, who made this release: thank you! Now I'm using it as my main system.


Fyr wrote:Escuse mua, but I'm gonna post my sadness..
I'm really displeased that Russian language is missed by the developers in: 32-, 64-bit DVD and Dual-Arch distros at the download page. But there'are presented its dialects - Belorussian and Ukranian. Why? You have cut your Russian-speaking users from 400 mlns to 60 mlns.

It is true only for dual-arch ISO. Also, Ukrainian and Belorussian are not dialects, you should know it.
Though, I think that Russian should be present too.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby Fyr » Jun 5th, '11, 12:18

In answer to all the posts above:

The Linux timeline. The Linux forks of forks don't live long. But, there are the lucky exceptions, for example, Ubuntu. Pay attention to the Mandrake branch, the authors hasn't included the Mageia distribution, in spite of its starting date - September, 2010.

Also, Ukrainian and Belorussian are not dialects, you should know it.

Unfortunately, the demagogs don't need the truth, but the Belorussian and Ukranian idioms are the dialects of the russian language. I would write the proofs (starting from the works of Lomonosov (XVIII cent.) to the lection of Wasserman (XXI cent.)), but it would be out of the topic. Anyway, the developers have cut out the language, it means they have cut off the users.

I have written my first post, because I used Mandriva since Mandrake 7.0 and I've become a Mandriva Control Center addict and formed the RPM dependency, that made me allergic to the other distributions.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby ahmad » Jun 5th, '11, 18:52

Fyr wrote:In answer to all the posts above:

The Linux timeline. The Linux forks of forks don't live long. But, there are the lucky exceptions, for example, Ubuntu. Pay attention to the Mandrake branch, the authors hasn't included the Mageia distribution, in spite of its starting date - September, 2010.

Also, Ukrainian and Belorussian are not dialects, you should know it.

Unfortunately, the demagogs don't need the truth, but the Belorussian and Ukranian idioms are the dialects of the russian language. I would write the proofs (starting from the works of Lomonosov (XVIII cent.) to the lection of Wasserman (XXI cent.)), but it would be out of the topic. Anyway, the developers have cut out the language, it means they have cut off the users.

For the second (and last) time, your claim that Mageia "has cut out Russian-speaking users" isn't true at all, the Russian localisation packages that I've listed in my previous post are ALL available in the official repositories, and on the i586 and x86_64 DVD's, so please _check your facts_ before throwing accusations.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby John66 » Jun 5th, '11, 21:42

Fyr,

1. I suggest you should look and read better (and more carefully) "The Linux timeline" that you provided -so willingly- in your above post.
Then, you easily come to the conclusion that your argument: "Pay attention to the Mandrake branch, blah, blah, blah..." is false and it is misleading the readers of your post... intentionally?

As I am sure, you and everyone, can see in "the Linux timetable" that:
Every start (beginning, birth) of a distribution is marked at the month of the year they had their first official release of the distribution, meaning, when the actual media (cd iso or dvd iso, or whatever)
appeared for downloading. That was their "starting date", not when their developers & contributors made an announcement of it, or when they talked about it, or dreamed about it.
That is why every year in the chart is devided in 12 columns by these "thin, gray, vertical" lines (can you see them?)

For example, as you have mentioned them already:
Mandriva: July 1998 (7th month of the year 1998)
Ubuntu: October 2004 (10th month of the year 2004)
Feel free to check every distro in the timeline, you'll be amazed by the accuracy of it, the authors are doing really a good job!

So... that's why Mageia is not included in this chart:
The chart, "the Linux timeline", stops (for all distros) at the very beginning of April 2010 (yes, the 4th month of the year 2010, 15 months ago).
They didn't "vanish" from Linux History altogether that month last year, I'm sure of it (as everyone else). Most probably, around that time, the authors published that chart, don't you think?

In September 2010 (the 9th month of 2010), some months after this "Linux timeline" published, it was announced by the new Mageia Community, that they would release a new distribution.
And they did! On time!
In June 2011 (the 6th month of the year 2011) -1st of June, to be accurate- Mageia 1 (official) was released.
This is the distribution's starting date. Got it?

This year, or whenever the authors publish a new "Linux timeline" chart, it will be different.
In the 6th month of 2011, there will be a color dot that marks the birth (starting date) of the Mageia distribution and the line that starts from this dot will be very long (but you already realized that, otherwise you wouldn't post, right?)


2. As for your accusations, about the Russian language localization packages in the distribution, ahmad already answered you, twice, that they are false. These accusations were also an "unintentional mistake"?
As you -and everyone else- understand, Mageia is not cutting off users who speak Russian, on the contrary, everyone is welcomed to contribute. (You could help also... but I forgot, you have allergies).
And if some web pages are not yet completely translated... they will be, as the user base and contributors base grows larger, because is about that: contribution, community work.
It depends of the number of the people contributing-helping and also in diversity of spoken languages among them.
For example: You can't accuse me for not helping in Spanish translation, because I don't speak Spanish. Got it?


3. About that "fork of the fork of the fork" thing, "the Linux timeline" proves you wrong.
You shouldn't use arguments, that cancel your previous arguments.

Your fantasy could be right, if:
From Mandriva, a new, "Mandriva-like-X" distro was forked,
then from "Mandriva-like-X", a new distro "Mandriva-like-Z" was forked,
then from "Mandriva-like-Z", Mageia was forked.
But, we both know this is not true... This is not the case...

Mageia is a fork of the Mandriva distribution, yes. I could say, a continuation of the Mandriva distribution.
Why?
Because the Mandriva 2011 beta3, I installed two days ago, looked like "a Mandriva fork" to me...


You see, I'm allergic also (to unfairness, to ungratefulness, to blind-minded people)...
I could write more, I stop here.

PS. Sorry, from all the other users & readers, for the long post.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby Tom » Jun 11th, '11, 21:24

Hi :)

Congrats!! :D WooooHoooo !!

I first heard of Mageia through DistroWatch but only just noticed your first release thanks to an interesting article in The Inquirer
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/rev ... geia-linux
It was the article that was the clincher for trying out the first release this early.

I didn't know where to post about it so i copied this post to another thread in case one of them was the right place
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=440&p=3305#p3305
Congrats and regards from
Tom :)
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby rtzed » Jun 13th, '11, 06:43

Thank you for all the work. I have just installed the 64 bit KDE with no serious problems showing up (yet). Prefer Seamonkey for mail/browser but haven't been able to find it.. Mandriva hasn't worked for me for last two versions, so I am glad to be back in familiar territory.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby jkerr82508 » Jun 13th, '11, 07:55

seamonkey is now called iceape in Mageia. (IIRC seamonkey had to be modified slightly because some Mozilla trademarks cannot be re-distributed.)

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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby Alfred » Jun 17th, '11, 12:31

Congratulations
I will watch with interest it's development.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby iustus » Jun 20th, '11, 21:46

Congratulations !
Using Live CD I did not have any problem . Suggesting next revision Live CD pls include Adobe Flah . I downloaded into RAM and could see lot of internet TV stations even . Libre-Office OK webmail OK Kopete OK . I am Ubuntu Gnome User but also KDE is going very good . Thanks a lot very good work done !
Iustus Madrid Spain
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby Fyr » Jun 27th, '11, 08:26

Sorry, not sorting out the language problem, I have posted the messages here.

I have installed the Mageia distro. I was very glad to see that the OS found out all devices (Mandriva 2010.2 didn't).

But the impossibility of choosing the packets to install at the first stage of installation greaves me. Return it back!

[ I could only choose how I would intend to use my computer - as a desktop or a server =( ]
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby jkerr82508 » Jun 27th, '11, 09:54

Fyr wrote:But the impossibility of choosing the packets to install at the first stage of installation greaves me.

That option is present in the DVD (but not the live CD's). (It was never present in the Mandriva live CD's.)

I could only choose how I would intend to use my computer - as a desktop or a server

I don't recall ever seeing that question.

Are you sure that you installed Mageia (and not a beta of Mandriva 2011)?

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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby wobo » Jun 27th, '11, 09:59

Fyr wrote:Sorry, not sorting out the language problem, I have posted the messages here.
I have installed the Mageia distro. I was very glad to see that the OS found out all devices (Mandriva 2010.2 didn't).
But the impossibility of choosing the packets to install at the first stage of installation greaves me. Return it back!
[ I could only choose how I would intend to use my computer - as a desktop or a server =( ]

Hmm, which media did you use for installation?
Only the Installation DVD lets you select several DEs, package groups, single packages.
With the LiveCD as installation media you can always customize your system from the net after the installation.
Where did you find this selection "Desktop or Server"?

EDIT: Jim was faster this time because I had to check the DualArch for this unknown selection of desktop or server. :)
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby wobo » Jun 27th, '11, 10:02

jkerr82508 wrote:Are you sure that you installed Mageia (and not a beta of Mandriva 2011)?

I don't recall this selection from my Beta3 installation of Mandriva 2011.

Last time I saw this question was years ago (it was in SuSE IIRC)
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby doktor5000 » Jun 29th, '11, 16:54

I think you could select Server, it was a package group/category in the package selection before Mandriva
put the screen with the desktop environment choice in front of it. But this is really some years ago ...
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby dubigrasu » Jun 30th, '11, 07:35

I first heard of Mageia through DistroWatch but only just noticed your first release thanks to an interesting article in The Inquirer
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/rev ... geia-linux
It was the article that was the clincher for trying out the first release this early.

Just stumble upon this.

So:
We caught up with Patricia Fraser, who is the communications team representative on the Mageia community council

Community council? This has something to do with the community of Mageia? Well, this is a good start for a community representative considering the fact that we never seen her around.
Or maybe is some other kind of Mageia comunity...
As to how Mageia got started, Fraser said, "Our founders came from the Mandriva distribution, and our community followed them.

Not quite true I'm afraid, Mandriva was already quasi deserted by its users (gone to other distros) and only parts of its remaining community followed. (Some returned to Mageia though, at least to throw a peek)
An ordinary Mageia user can have more say in the future of this distribution than anywhere else.

I seriously doubt that.
It seems that Mageia decided not to distribute proprietary software drivers on the installation media. Indeed, the Mageia DVD is more than 100MB smaller than the Mandriva 2010 DVD.

We can't understand why Mageia did this when the free ATI driver doesn't work. Perhaps it was out of a somewhat misguided zeal to support free software. If that was the case, then it should understand that this was a bad decision.

It will have the effect of turning off people who casually try Mageia, and they'll drop it when their video card doesn't work right first time. We've tried other Linux distributions that had this problem, and gave up on them at that point. If we weren't reviewing it, we might have given up on Mageia, too.

Here here.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby wobo » Jun 30th, '11, 10:41

dubigrasu wrote:
I first heard of Mageia through DistroWatch but only just noticed your first release thanks to an interesting article in The Inquirer
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/rev ... geia-linux
It was the article that was the clincher for trying out the first release this early.

Just stumble upon this.

So you missed out on all the documents which may answer your questions and doubts.

So:
We caught up with Patricia Fraser, who is the communications team representative on the Mageia community council

Community council? This has something to do with the community of Mageia? Well, this is a good start for a community representative considering the fact that we never seen her around.
Or maybe is some other kind of Mageia comunity...

Pls read carefully. Patricia is leader of the MarCom (Marketing & Communications) team, responsible for press releases, blog posts, marketing actions, etc. What you mean is "Community relations and communication" which is done by all, some more, some less. The moderators of this forum are an important part of it, also people like me (as a member of the founders group) and all others.
You seem to have missed out on the most important informations, like what the Community Council is, the governance model ( see http://mageia.org/wiki/doku.php?id=org )

As to how Mageia got started, Fraser said, "Our founders came from the Mandriva distribution, and our community followed them.

Not quite true I'm afraid, Mandriva was already quasi deserted by its users (gone to other distros) and only parts of its remaining community followed. (Some returned to Mageia though, at least to throw a peek)

I think you are judging by your individual perception which differs from what I experienced over the last year (and you know that I have been quite active and present). I have not seen users quitting Mandriva in masses, there was the occasional "I am out of here!" and there was also the occasional "New here!" - at least, that's what I read from the forums.
If you had followed the reactions and feedback over the last 9 months you could say that Patricia's statement was true.

An ordinary Mageia user can have more say in the future of this distribution than anywhere else.

I seriously doubt that.

And your doubt is based on ... what?
Have you looked at the structure of the Mageia community?
Have you followed the discussions in the mailing lists, where numerous users participated and discussed with developpers and everybody else?
Have you looked at the various teams and their performance over the last 8 months?

It seems that Mageia decided not to distribute proprietary software drivers on the installation media. Indeed, the Mageia DVD is more than 100MB smaller than the Mandriva 2010 DVD.
We can't understand why Mageia did this when the free ATI driver doesn't work. Perhaps it was out of a somewhat misguided zeal to support free software. If that was the case, then it should understand that this was a bad decision.
It will have the effect of turning off people who casually try Mageia, and they'll drop it when their video card doesn't work right first time. We've tried other Linux distributions that had this problem, and gave up on them at that point. If we weren't reviewing it, we might have given up on Mageia, too.

Here here.

"Here here" - what? You may not believe blindly what such reviews tell you, you may look for yourself:
Mageia has the same distribution policy as Mandriva had with 2010.x: A "free edition" DVD without proprietary drivers and live cds for KDE and Gnome including proprietary drivers.
So, the author of the review did not do his homework, sadly. To avoid this in German reviews we started a couple of years ago to write the reviews and send them in to a magazine - then we were sure that a review is not tainted by wrong information.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby dubigrasu » Jun 30th, '11, 11:05

Well, for someone having the words Community relations and communication in her title she is terribly absent and not communicating from/in this community, or just the title is very misleading anyway.
I have not seen users quitting Mandriva in masses

Sadly I seen, it started slowly after AW left, and is not just an impression.
Have you followed the discussions in the mailing lists, where numerous users participated and discussed with developpers and everybody else?

Yes, and that's exactly why I'm saying this. It could be that I'm more pessimist though.

About here here: OK, he is saying that:
Perhaps it was out of a somewhat misguided zeal to support free software. If that was the case, then it should understand that this was a bad decision.

I can't really say that it was a bad decision, is just what free software is, period. I might not like the decision but in the end they (devs etc) know better I suppose. But (bad or good decision) it does/could lead to this:
It will have the effect of turning off people who casually try Mageia, and they'll drop it when their video card doesn't work right first time.

Not forgetting that lack of wireless firmware that could keep the user from connecting to the Internet in some cases.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby wobo » Jun 30th, '11, 11:15

dubigrasu wrote:Well, for someone having the words Community relations and communication in her title she is terribly absent and not communicating from/in this community, or just the title is very misleading anyway.
Please read again: Patricia is NOT team leader of "Community relations", this is not written anywhere in the review. It is something you are making up. She is the "Representative of the Marketing & Communication team in the Community Council". If your read a line like "Mr. Brown is the President's advisor", do you read that as "Mr. Brown is the President"?

I have not seen users quitting Mandriva in masses

Sadly I seen, it started slowly after AW left, and is not just an impression.

Do you have any figures to prove your point? As long as you don't, it#s not more than an impression, same as mine - which tells different.

About here here: OK, he is saying that:
Perhaps it was out of a somewhat misguided zeal to support free software. If that was the case, then it should understand that this was a bad decision.

I can't really say that it was a bad decision, is just what free software is, period. I might not like the decision but in the end they (devs etc) know better I suppose. But (bad or good decision) it does/could lead to this:
It will have the effect of turning off people who casually try Mageia, and they'll drop it when their video card doesn't work right first time.

Not forgetting that lack of wireless firmware that could keep the user from connecting to the Internet in some cases.

Yes, and I told you that the author's conclusion is based on wrong information, he did not do his home work, he stated false information, etc.
Look at the download page yourself. It's all there. Mageia did NOT decide different as it has been in Mandriva. Mageia does NOT decide against delivering non-free / proprietary drivers.
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby rda » Jun 30th, '11, 11:23

Fyr wrote:I'm really displeased that Russian language is missed by the developers in: 32-, 64-bit DVD and Dual-Arch distros at the download page.
Russian is in, but indeed, while rewriting the page, we lost it; fixed (it's in Europa 2 Live CD's and it's in the DVD of course).

Also the russian version of the site is translated partly, awry, there is no Mageia's russian forum.

That's up to the Russian translation team - you are welcome to help, see the team here: http://mageia.org/wiki/doku.php?id=translators .
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Re: We finally did it: Mageia 1 is available!

Postby dubigrasu » Jun 30th, '11, 13:16

As I said, the words Mageia community (in article) are misleading, that's why I asked if it has something to do with the actual community. Didn't knew about this Mageia Community council being something totally different than this (People) Community, sorry about that. BTW, who is Mr Brown?
Do you have any figures to prove your point?

I'm talking about the community as is it seen in the forum activity, I kept visiting that forum (still do) and that place was deserted (not so more recently).
There is no need to prove that with figures, simply there was almost no one there.
Mageia does NOT decide against delivering non-free / proprietary drivers.

I'm talking about the decision to use a free software DVD, no matter who's decision was.
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